Israel and the Palestinians need to find peace–then reconcoliation will happen. While I disagree with your categorization that “deliberate strategy of the nascent Jewish state to drive Arabs from homes and villages in territory within and outside the U.N. Partition that Israel’s leaders intended to be resettled by Jews.” I have read Benny Morris’s book on the the creation of the Palesitinian refugee situation and the Nakba was not deliberate. It was, and remains, horrible. Israel needs to make amends as do Palstinians. We have continually hurt each other and done so much damage.

I find that I often prefer to talk to right-wing Jews. At least I do not wonder if they are trying to do some “liberal do-gooder” thing. They know what they want and I find that I respect them more. Stand up for what your people need as I will. We can then do it as adults and not do it out of pity.

Just to clarify - I don’t think the post says anywhere that Tunisians are Palestinians. Tunisians and Palestinians are Arabs, however; and my point was about the relationship between Jews and Arabs - in which Jewish treatment of the Palestinians plays as great a role as Arab treatment of the Jews.

I can’t agree with you on Righteous Victims. Morris’s whole point is that it was deliberate. I quote from the first edition, Chapter 5, paperback, 2001, page 253:

Recently declassified Zionist documents demonstrate that a virtual consensus emerged among the Zionist leadership, int he wake of the publication in July 1937 of the Peel Commission Recommendations, in favor of the transfer of at least several hundred thousand Palestinian Arabs - if not all of them - out of the areas of the Jewish state to be. The tone was set by Ben-Gurion himself in June 1938: “I support compulsory transfer. I do not see in it anything immoral.”

Morris later came to believe that the transfer was justified, but this is quite a different thing than saying it was not deliberate. It was.

It seems to me there are both Arabs and Jews who support ethnic separatism. There are Jews who would like to see an Israel with no Arabs (many would like to see it extending to the Jordan River); and there are Arabs who would like to see the Arab states (some would say the entire Arabian peninsula) with no Jews or Christians.

Certainly, people who view the world that way would tend to see eye-to-eye. All that’s necessary is some horse-trading, to decide which blocks of land belong to Jews and which to Arabs.

My own view is that the ethnic state is a bad form of government, which is prone to victimize minorities, and which cannot evolve into a full democracy. I do not think a state based on ethnic separatism and persecution of minorities is true to the values or the history of Judaism.

As to whether ethnic cleansing is a true expression of Islamic ideas - I would hope not, but, since I’m not well qualified to speak on that topic, I leave it to you to respond.

Do I like that the Zionists came? No but I understand that they were trying to escape oppression. I think both peoples hurt each other. I am trying to be a realist. As I have stated elsewhere, I actually prefer the folks at AIPAC. Liberal do-gooder Jews are just trying to absolve their conscience of whatever guilt they have because Jews do not act perfect. Acchhh… I have had the best conversations with conservative Zionists who say “this is what I want” and I can see “this is what I want” not the JVP types telling me that I am “poor and oppressed.”

I really do think Jews need to do a lot of healing. You think it is not true to the values of Judaim…could be but you do sound a bit holier than thou saying it.

Well, I’m curious - what is it you’re saying to these conservative AIPAC types? How do you represent the Palestinian position when you talk with them?

What do you say about the right of return, for example? Certainly there is a large Palestinian movement in support of this. And where do you stand on the Israeli occupation of the West Bank? Palestinian organizations and politicians make a convincing case that the people there are oppressed under military rule (and, having spent some time there, I would find it hard to disagree).

If you are representing Palestinian interests, and the Jews you’re speaking with are listening and understanding, and vice versa, then, great - more power to you, you have made a good dialogue, and if you don’t want anything to do with liberal Jews, it’s your own business.

If, on the other hand, you’re out there justifying the Israeli viewpoint (i.e. “Israel gets the blame for what the entire world does”) then I can see why the AIPAC types like you. When they’re making a case for, say, unilateral withdrawal, which would allow Israel to draw its borders to its own advantage without interference, it’s very vindicating (and useful) to find Arabs who agree with them.